Communities

Writing
Writing
Codidact Meta
Codidact Meta
The Great Outdoors
The Great Outdoors
Photography & Video
Photography & Video
Scientific Speculation
Scientific Speculation
Cooking
Cooking
Electrical Engineering
Electrical Engineering
Judaism
Judaism
Languages & Linguistics
Languages & Linguistics
Software Development
Software Development
Mathematics
Mathematics
Christianity
Christianity
Code Golf
Code Golf
Music
Music
Physics
Physics
Linux Systems
Linux Systems
Power Users
Power Users
Tabletop RPGs
Tabletop RPGs
Community Proposals
Community Proposals
tag:snake search within a tag
answers:0 unanswered questions
user:xxxx search by author id
score:0.5 posts with 0.5+ score
"snake oil" exact phrase
votes:4 posts with 4+ votes
created:<1w created < 1 week ago
post_type:xxxx type of post
Search help
Notifications
Mark all as read See all your notifications »
Q&A

What Kind of Story can Achieve Cult Status?

+0
−0

Note: I have rewritten this question, upon realizing it was being misinterpreted. Please reread the question and provide new answers accordingly.

Star Wars. Lord of the Rings. Star Trek. These are the phenomena of stories that never die. These stories have what I'm calling (for lack of a better term) 'cult status'. By that, I mean they have more than simply a huge fan-base. They have fanatics, people who study and live the stories to the point of obsession.

Having people like this interested in your story is generally a good thing, as it means that you have a group of people sure to buy your story if you ever write another one. It's guaranteed sales. Publishing is practically a given.

Key Assumption: I believe that not every story lends itself to this 'cult status'.

As an example, you have Lord of the Rings and Pride and Prejudice. LotR has served as the inspiration for countless fantasy stories, spawned some of the greatest movies made, and has a backing of fanatical fans, who have studied its lore to the point where they know the species of every far off land and can speak Elvish flawlessly.

Pride and Prejudice also has its followers and worshipers. But you don't see people donning early 19th century costumes at 'Jane Austen fests', or quoting the dialogue to each other, or endlessly speculating on what random details of the book might mean. Maybe you do in small groups, but not in large numbers. Not like with LotR. Or Star Wars, or Star Trek, or any of the other big cult names out there.

Why is this? The two novels above are merely examples; there are other comparisons. Why is it that some popular novels/movies achieve 'cult status' while others - which are still certainly very popular - do not?

Key Theory: These observations have led me to believe that there is a common denominator with the stories that have 'cult status', and that the stories which do not have this status, also do not have that common denominator.

Am I correct? If so, what is that common denominator? What makes a story able to attain 'cult status' (I realize you must have a good story first - that is another question)? If I'm wrong, then why is it that stories which are written equally well have such different receptions (maybe not at the time of publishing, certainly, but I am speaking of the current times)?

History
Why does this post require moderator attention?
You might want to add some details to your flag.
Why should this post be closed?

0 comment threads

3 answers

You are accessing this answer with a direct link, so it's being shown above all other answers regardless of its score. You can return to the normal view.

+0
−0

I think your revised question reveals a confusion of two different things. There are works with strong and enduring followings, and there are works that inspire roleplaying. There may be some intersection between these two categories, but they are by no means the same thing.

The roleplaying phenomena seems to have arisen out of comic books with no particular literary merit. As far as I can tell, there is not a lot of ongoing readership of older comic books. The time I went into a comic book store looking for something for my grandson, I did not find a shelf of classic comic books. All the action seems to be in new titles. The cult is a cult of the characters, not the works. Feeding the cult of the character requires a continual stream of new work. That in itself indicates that there is little literary merit here, the real attraction is the brand.

Why are people attracted to brands? Because associating themselves with brands makes them feel better about themselves in some way. Why does the bullied kid identify with Bat Man? Because Bat Man can fight bullies. Why do people buy iPhones or Gucci, or Ferraris? To make a statement about themselves to the world.

Branding is a big thing in the entertainment world now. Comic Con may have started out of fan obsession with Iron Man, but the whole phenomena has been thoroughly corporatized to the point where they design the dolls and the lunchboxes before they ever writer the script.

Role playing is about brand identity, not literary merit. Beating Disney at this game today is going to be next to impossible. Writing a book with a strong and enduring following, on the other hand, is about literary excellence, and does not involve any dressing up or conference attending.

History
Why does this post require moderator attention?
You might want to add some details to your flag.

0 comment threads

+1
−0

Given the non-standard usage of the term "cult status" in the OP

Works that inspire unusually passionate or devoted fans do have a common denominator --they are risky, challenging, eccentric, or otherwise outside the norm. Works of this sort have an uphill battle to reach mainstream popularity. A challenging work that does become a hit is therefore particularly notable. In order to transition from a cult hit to a mainstream hit, a work typically needs to be a) exceptionally good, b) adopted as the pet project of someone with a lot of resources and/or cultural cachet, or c) happen to hit the larger cultural zeitgeist at exactly the right moment (and/or survive until the larger culture catches up --i.e., LOTR).

The reasons behind this are pretty straightforward. Work that is well-executed but safe, or less unusual, may consistently draw fans over a long period of time, but people are less likely to be passionate about it because it will be more interchangeable with other things that are widely available. What sparks intense devotion is something that feels completely unique, irreplaceable and irreplicable.

There are some factors to this that are largely out of your control --in particular, it's hard to know what will hit the zeitgeist in the future (chasing current trends is usually a losing game with a huge number of competitors). What you can (try to) do is create the best possible work, that fully reflects your own personal idiosyncratic eccentricities and unique vision. If it reflects the experiences and perspective of some under-served niche group, so much the better. That way, it's more likely to embody (a) and pick up (b). (Conversely, if you just want popularity, but not devotion, pour resources and excellent execution into something safe, non-threatening, and reflective of trends that are bubbling just under the surface of mainstream ubiquity. Just make sure to get there first.)

History
Why does this post require moderator attention?
You might want to add some details to your flag.

This post was sourced from https://writers.stackexchange.com/a/41101. It is licensed under CC BY-SA 3.0.

0 comment threads

+0
−0

If you don't think Pride and Prejudice has cult status, you are looking in the wrong place. It's cultists are called Janeites.

And I think you may be overestimating the staying power of Star Wars and Star Trek. They are now brands more than they are art, and the ordinariness of the latest entries in both series is palpable. They are formula cinema. Star Trek, for instance, has not dealt with the kinds of complex ideas of the original series for a very long time. They have become branded space operas. And Star Wars has lost the innocence and simplicity of the original. They are brands, not cults. And how much of an ongoing audience is there for the originals of each?

LOTR is a different matter. The books are still read and admired. But their influence is not what it was. When I was in college -- many moons ago -- it was the book everyone had read. Literally, if you had read a book, it was that book. It isn't that anymore. It's audience has narrowed considerably from what it was. It is now a genre book in a way it was not back then. There is still much to admire about it, but I think the mantle of immortality has not quite been earned yet.

But that aside, I think the attempt to find the formula for cult status is misguided. One of the hallmarks of great works, whether their greatness is time-limited or not, is authenticity. They were not designed and calculated for the cult status they achieved. They were products of an authentic personal vision, and I imagine the extent of their success was a surprise to their authors as much as anyone else.

There is a formula for predictable content. Disney and Harlequin are both companies who can turn out popular entertainments with remarkable regularity and can make a lot of money doing it. But most other media companies can't reproduce their consistency, and Disney and Harlequin don't seem to be able to expand it outside the fields in which they have been successful.

And none of these works has achieved the kind of cult status you are talking about. Their very reliability seems to militate against it. Art is about vision, and vision is a fickle mistress. In other words, vision is not the kind of property you want to build a commercial formula on. You don't want to break new ground. You want to optimize the productivity of a well-tilled field. Actually, one of the hallmarks of a cult work is that no one can figure out how to reproduce the effect. (In favor of LOTR's cult status, we can note that not one of its millions of imitators are actually anything like it.)

Have a vision. Commit to it. Bury yourself in it. Hone it mercilessly and without compromise. If you do this there is a small chance you may capture something that captures the imagination of an age, or even the imagination of many ages. These chances are very very small. But they are the only chances you have.

Or, you know, be commercial. Work hard at it, hone your craft, and you might make a decent living at it. Get picked up by a company that wants to brand your stuff and you could make a very good living. It's not the road to cult status, but it puts food on the table.

TLDR: You can become a brand by trying to; you become a cult in spite of yourself.

History
Why does this post require moderator attention?
You might want to add some details to your flag.

0 comment threads

Sign up to answer this question »