Communities

Writing
Writing
Codidact Meta
Codidact Meta
The Great Outdoors
The Great Outdoors
Photography & Video
Photography & Video
Scientific Speculation
Scientific Speculation
Cooking
Cooking
Electrical Engineering
Electrical Engineering
Judaism
Judaism
Languages & Linguistics
Languages & Linguistics
Software Development
Software Development
Mathematics
Mathematics
Christianity
Christianity
Code Golf
Code Golf
Music
Music
Physics
Physics
Linux Systems
Linux Systems
Power Users
Power Users
Tabletop RPGs
Tabletop RPGs
Community Proposals
Community Proposals
tag:snake search within a tag
answers:0 unanswered questions
user:xxxx search by author id
score:0.5 posts with 0.5+ score
"snake oil" exact phrase
votes:4 posts with 4+ votes
created:<1w created < 1 week ago
post_type:xxxx type of post
Search help
Notifications
Mark all as read See all your notifications »
Q&A

Post History

60%
+1 −0
Q&A Subverting the emotional woman and stoic man trope

tl;dr- Frame-challenging in that I don't think you're actually subverting the trope. While your male characters don't sound like paragons of masculinity, they're not especially subversive either....

posted 4y ago by Nat‭  ·  last activity 4y ago by System‭

Answer
#3: Attribution notice added by user avatar System‭ · 2019-12-08T12:59:38Z (over 4 years ago)
Source: https://writers.stackexchange.com/a/48108
License name: CC BY-SA 4.0
License URL: https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/
#2: Initial revision by user avatar Nat‭ · 2019-12-08T12:59:38Z (over 4 years ago)
 **_tl;dr_-** Frame-challenging in that I don't think you're actually subverting the trope. While your male characters don't sound like paragons of masculinity, they're not especially subversive either. Your female characters aren't subversive at all; they're textbook [neurotic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroticism), which is entirely consistent with standard tropes. Given this lack of subversion, I don't think you really have a problem.

**NOTE:** This answer is on the subject of stereotypes and stereotypical thinking. Obviously, stereotypes and tropes aren't robust scientific models, nor are they prescriptions for how people should act. Obviously real people can be far more complex, and there's no reason anyone should feel obligated to conform to a stereotype.

* * *

[Stoics](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoicism) strive to be at-peace with the world. Intellectually, their thoughts are based in correspondence to nature. Stoics don't tend to engage in social thinking; for example, you can insult them or praise them – it's meaningless either way.

So the stoic-men/neurotic-women trope is kinda like:

1. Men act independently based on their own internal direction. They do what they need to do achieve their goals; what others think, whether good or bad, doesn't matter.

2. Women act dependently with a heavy focus on social dynamics. They'll act in response to others' desires, and they're obsessed with how others view them.

Then for your story:

1. 

> The girls and women in the story, Eris, Marina, and Ezrith, display very little emotion--Eris represses her emotions so that they only come on rarely and in intense waves, Marina only shows emotional vulnerability to those she trusts, and Ezrith's fears and love for others only manifest in controlling behavior and frustration directed at her family and friends.

These female characters sound [neurotic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroticism), which definitely plays into common stereotypes. That they're suppressing their emotions for social reasons is again playing into that women-act-dependently trope, where they're altering their behavior due to perceived social pressure.

2. 

> However, the boys and men, Leo, Alexander, and Caspian, are very much in touch with their emotions--Leo, although gruff, communicates most everything he feels to his loved ones, Alexander is a humorous and empathetic man who constantly watches out for others, and Caspian is a patient and levelheaded dreamer who is unafraid to display affection and his own happiness, sadness, and anger.

You know how when an author writes a character very different from themself, the result can feel a bit off? Sorta like the author started from something very different, then applied a bunch of stereotypes? These characters sound kinda female, but morphed to fit male stereotypes. As such, they're not particularly masculine-sounding, but they don't sound all that subversive, either.

Overall, all of your characters sound like they're built from a stereotypically female starting point. The female characters are then morphed by neurotic tenancies, which really just makes them even more stereotypically female. The male characters are morphed by outwardly displaying the emotions that they have, which actually makes them more masculine than they'd have been if you didn't morph them.

In short, you may want to give some consideration to understanding the masculine perspective to better inform writing masculine characters, but trope-subversion doesn't seem like an issue here.

#1: Imported from external source by user avatar System‭ · 2019-09-21T12:06:12Z (over 4 years ago)
Original score: 4